Episode 12: Guilty Until Proven Innocent- Addressing False Accusations and Their Impact on Educators

Alright, y'all, before we start, because some of y'all be tripping under the advice of counsel, I gotta add that the views, thoughts, opinions that are expressed on this podcast are mine and mine alone. They do not represent my employer. Alright, let's go straight is my because I was like, damn, do we really want to get into this discussion? Because if we get into this discussion right here, y'all woman all right, y'all. Welcome back to another episode of Ridgemont for Spine is the podcast. Today's episode is sponsored by AJ insures me where we don't do barbecue plates. What's up, AJ? What's the thing? No barbecue plates. No barbecue. No barbecue plates. What does that mean? Tell us. Rightly? We got AJ in the building with us today. What does no barbecue plates mean? Thank you. Thank you, thank you. Happy to be here. We have to do better. I've been doing this too long to continue to try to sell raffle tickets for folks that unfortunately pass away or four wheelers or equipment in the family farm. No barbecue place. We can't buy enough brisket. We're not standing in the heat grill. We can't do that. We grieving gucci belt on a insurance policy. We could do something about it. All right? So thank you. All right, so today we are discussing the plight of wrongfully accused teachers. When teachers are wrongfully accused of not so nice things against their students in their classrooms and then they are eventually acquitted or exonerated, how do we right those wrongs and just walking through the investigation process today? So we do have Ty with Workforce equity solutions. She's a former HR director, so she is going to give us all the tea when it comes to teachers and school districts and investigations. And then AJ is going to talk to us about having professional liability insurance to cover you in case you get hit with one of those cases. All right, so we are talking about this topic because last week, I don't know if you all kept up, but there was a teacher, a local high school teacher that was accused back in December. Some students said that he did some inappropriate things to them several times in front of the classroom. So they had this really well made out story and immediately this teacher's name, face, job, location, everything was just blasted all across the media and reputation instantly ruined. All right, this was in December. So a couple of weeks ago, someone sent me a press release that was supposed to be released to the world, but never was released to the world. That exonerated him. Said, we conducted a full investigation and basically found out that this one kid who started it and the 20 other that came along with the same story, the story wasn't the story. So now what happens to this man after he has had to dip into retirement, take out loans to fund the defense, to keep his freedom and save his reputation when it's already torn and nothing happened to the kids. Everybody gets to walk off into the sunset except for this teacher and his family. So we don't talk about that today. So the first thing I kind of want to get into is the media sensationalism and the public perception when a teacher is wrongfully accused. So I'm using this teacher as an example. But this has happened to several other teachers even just this year because it's so prominent. Now, let me also issue a disclaimer that a lot of times teachers are innocent and a lot of times they're not. I hate to say it, but we see it too many times where they really guilty of some of the stuff that they are accused of. But this particular situation, this particular situation with this teacher man, he went through a lot. Even talking to him, I actually had an opportunity to reach out to him and instantly things like death threats against his family, death threats against his wife, death threats against his children, having to stay up at night while his kids and his wife slept so that he could protect the house. Because once your name is out there, people can easily go to your property taxes, find your address. And they were threatening to kill this man and threatening just making all these other fake social media pages against him. So it was a lot. Now, what I found interesting because I ended up getting in contact with a couple of the media outlets who pushed the story out. And what I found interesting is how shady, how dirty the media is when it comes to these stories because did you all know that I'm not going to say their name because I don't want them suing me. We have a certain news outlet here in Houston and you go online, there's a paid version and an unpaid version. So you get the paid version where you have a subscription, where you get all the tea and you get the news first. The paid subscription gives you anybody's name. So if they're accused of a crime, they put their name, their location, all of those things like that. But the unpaid version just gives you very broad details, like a teacher at a local area, high school, whatever. So when I'm getting in contact, talking to one of the reporters who released the story, first, he emailed me back and he's like, oh no, I did the unpaid version of the story and my story didn't have his name and his job location. So I had to pull like a dish you and send him the link where now this your name and this says this man's name, his picture, all of his personally identifiable information and you're responsible for this. So with the same energy that you were eager to push the story out, I need you to have the same energy when it comes to this press release that was hidden by their school district to clear this man's name, and it wasn't. So before we get into that, I want to ask you guys, do you all think that the press or the media should be held liable when things like this happens, or is it just them doing their job? Absolutely. I do think that they have a responsibility to report the truth. And I think that as we move forward in these situations, this is a very sensitive situation. This is someone's livelihood, their career, and the impact that it has on their family and their career moving forward. And I have read some cases in other states where there was one case where something very similar happened, and the person sued the media and won, like, $4 million. So I think that if we see more cases where someone suing someone for slander, the impact that it has, the harm that it does to their career, that they'll probably think twice before they report stories that are not true. I've seen stories in the past where if they misstated something, they'll go back. But usually it's in very fine print. Where you're hidden all down the page. Where you can't find it. So it's just a very unfortunate situation, because I do believe that the school district should also be held accountable and take some level of responsibility for that person in their career when they're harmed in a situation like that. So I'm going to ask you, AJ, when it comes to the school districts being responsible or having some level of protection, how liable is the school district, or how far do you think the school district should go to protect the teacher? I always said that school districts are always going to cover their behinds before they cover anybody else's behinds. And so if an allegation is lodged against the teacher, is it the school district's responsibility to first protect the teacher, protect themselves, protect the student? There definitely is a chain there, and I believe no one wants negative press, right? Especially from a school district's perspective. And I personally believe the school district will go exhaust all of its resources, want to protect the district and its employees. I personally believe that. I personally believe that. I think they should. Now, once you get into the meat and potatoes of the incident or what's caused this attention, then the school districts or the teacher will have to decide what the ramifications are based on, who's accountable, who's at fault. Right. And there are some things in place that both sides can be protected, but I believe the school district will go to bat for all of their employees, as they should, because it's an umbrella effect, right. So the school district is here. You got your employees down from teachers, administrators, coaches, and everybody, right. They will defend you until they can't. Until they can, unless you give them a reason. Not from the jump. Correct. Like you're guilty. Correct. It's obvious. Okay, so let's talk about the toll that it takes on the accused, their families, their children, their spouses. So we had this conversation before where we talk about them being victims as well. Nobody ever looks at them or considers them to be victims, right? Let's say, thank God, not married anymore, but I send my spouse off to work. He's an educator. I send him off to work and I'm thinking he's doing what he's supposed to do, kiss him on the cheek goodbye, pack his lunch, have a good day. And I have no idea that I'm sending off somebody that a, is probably doing something that they're not supposed to be doing or could be accused of doing something they're supposed to be doing. So as a spouse, how that impacts me, how the accusations impact me. So going back to this teacher where he's like, my wife, my kids, everybody just caught the brunt of the accusation. And I know personally a couple of situations where people that I have worked with that have had allegations lodged against them and their kids were in the districts that they worked at or in the school that they worked at. And so how they caught hell just because their father, their mother, guilty by association. Guilty by association. And so the emotional toll that it takes on them. So Tom will turn to you and talk about let's talk about the importance of due process in the legal rights. So a lot of times when these things happen and it hits the media, you are guilty until proven innocent instead of the opposite. Right. You're instantly guilty, especially when it comes to, I'm going to say, sexually involved cases with students or inappropriate contact or inappropriate communication with educators and students. So what exactly should happen when a teacher is accused or goes under investigation? And then tell us sometimes what does happen? We know it always doesn't go by the book. So tell us. I know I have to go by time because you all know defrance is to be on me about this time. But the extraordinary version of what should happen when allegations illogic is a teacher and then what sometimes does happen, certainly. I think the process is very clear, but I would like to just take a step back and just say that in an honest world and we know that unfortunately, some leaders are just not good leaders. And I do believe as HR professional is that any business, their first obligation, I guess, is to themselves and they're going to protect themselves by any means necessary, and especially if that particular organization lacks integrity in the leadership. And in some cases that I've been involved in, my role was to mitigate risk in any situation. So when we talk about due process, what typically happens if I would receive a report that a teacher has done something inappropriate, some type of misconduct, it falls into what we called a Title Six category. And so with that particular law, there's protections there for that child. And so in that situation, we would contact our Title Six coordinator, and that person will begin that investigatory process. They train managers and leaders on how to address and identify these issues or assess them so that we'll know if this needs to go further. But I think that in any situation, the best thing to do is to always make sure that 48 hours time limit that you have, you definitely need to report it. Is that 48 hours? Tell me about that 40 hours. So what will happen is I would bring that person in and have a conversation to just kind of not really investigate it, because what we don't want to do is compromise the integrity of the investigation. And so we're advised that if we believe that there has been some misconduct to immediately contact that Title Six investigator. But then we have 48 hours to report this to law officials. So there are some legalities that we have to follow as well by the state. But once that allegation, we tried to refrain from calling them accusers, so we name them respondents. Okay. And then the complainant would be the student. And so in those situations, we would turn it over to that Title Six investigator coordinator, and from there they would begin the investigation. Now, if there is suspicion that there is danger to the child or to anyone else, what we will most likely do is place that employee on administrative leave. Okay? So that's how that's decided? Yes. Okay. That child is in danger, or if I'm that child's teacher and I know that child has to come see me at first period or second period, I'm going to automatically be perceived as a danger, it's best to put me on leave. Well, it's very tough because we're placed in a situation where they're saying don't investigate. But I have to ask questions to know whether or not if this was just a kid that was angry with this teacher because they were given an assignment and they didn't want to do it. So we have to really kind of gauge, but it's best to be safe than sorry and to just kind of separate those individuals. But I think to what you were stating earlier, I would always want to protect the teachers and understanding that this is their career to ensure that there is due process and not create a worse situation. Okay. So when we know what should happen, what sometimes does happen. Now I know I've heard of situations and have been a part of situations where the parent will notify law enforcement before they notify the district. And so the district is kind of blindsided when the local PD shows up, the news media or the news media shows up, you're like, wait, I just got here. I didn't drink my coffee. What's going on? So what happens when a parent kind of jumps I don't want to say jumps the gun, but jumps the gun and goes to law enforcement before they notify the school district. Does the teacher automatically go on leave in before you guys do the investigation? Because now it could be a criminal case. Unfortunately, I would say that oftentimes school districts are going to pull the trigger because they're afraid of if this person is guilty and we didn't act with urgency, then we're liable. And that's where it gets kind of sticky in terms of due process. And so in a situation where if anyone is placed on administrative leave, it feels like discipline. And so in that situation, pretty much they're kind of like just sitting and waiting for the investigator to complete the investigation. They have several people involved that's involved in making the decision whether or not to bring that teacher back if there was actually a violation. And sometimes these situations take time you can't rush if there's allegations that a child has been harmed. And obviously the child is who we're most concerned about in the situation, we want to make sure that that child is safe, but also that other students are safe as well. Okay, so when we talk about the role of human resources in these investigations, explain your role in these investigations. I don't know if you've ever been I think you have in a situation where you've had to take the lead on some things that have happened, whether it be inappropriate physical contact or a restraint that didn't go right. So what has been your role in that, investigating that? Well, as an HR professional, it's always our role to mitigate risk. And you're right, I have been in those situations, and you act with urgency and whatever is going on that becomes a priority, child safety. And so what I've done in those situations, I may have the conversation with the person, the respondent, to hear their side of the story. And usually I would place that person on admin leave, not only to I want to protect everyone, okay? And that's the safest way to do it. And usually those employees are on paid admin leave and really just make sure that everyone's removed from the situation and turn it over to our title one. And I've had a situation where there are personality conflicts where you may have an administrator or a teacher that doesn't like another teacher, and so they may make an accusation against this teacher and totally false. And we have to be very careful. And that's why I think that it's important that we listen. And that's a big part of an HR representative is you want to listen to all the facts, gather all the facts. And I've had a situation where it was totally blown out of proportion, and it could have resulted in something very negative for that teacher. And I had a conversation, actually, with that employee to make sure that they understood the impact that a situation like this would have without gathering all the facts. And this employee happened to be an African American employee. And so I think that there's a deeper conversation because usually they're always guilty until proven innocent. And that's something that we're not really wanting to talk about, especially a black man in education. Absolutely. And so if you think about, let's say, a PE teacher, the scope of that person's job is to work directly with students. They're bending, they're instructing them to do different things. But if you have someone that suggest that this person made this type of comment, that could go all the way left. If the right people are in place to make sure that there is due process and they're gathering all of the facts before stating that this person did something wrong or there was misconduct, we. See that a lot with we had a conversation, we had, like, 15 black male educators in here probably a couple of weeks ago. And so that was another thing that came up, something as simple as them dress coding a student. Why? A lot of black men men, yes, in general. But a lot of black men are like, I'm not even going to ignore the dress. I mean, I'm ignored a dress code. I'm not even going to say anything to the kid because if I say, hey, you got your shirt is, the sleeve of your shirt is down to your navel. I can see everything exposed. Then you're going to say, Why are you looking at me? He's looking at me. I'm going to go file a case or charges against him because he's making me feel uncomfortable. And so a lot of times, you'll have some of my colleagues will just send me a text like, hey, can you come in here and look at Tamika? Because tamika is inappropriate. So then I can come in as a black woman or as a woman and say, tamika, come here, girl, what you got going on today? And that'll be received better than Mr. Williams saying something to Tamika. So a lot of them are scared to say that. And I also know that, and this is something else people don't like talking about, but we don't like to acknowledge how intelligent our students are when it comes to manipulating stories and things when they don't get their way. I remember probably about five years ago when I was at a school, maybe six years ago, I had a couple of white girls just going to say what it is. The white students who this was their first time having a black teacher in their lives, right? And so they did not you know, how we present, we present very strong, very confident, and my way is my way. My work is my work. I need it done. And so when you've never had that before and then you never had that from a black woman down like that. And so this group of girls is one main leader, who's her parent also was a teacher in the school district, got together, cooked up this beautiful story. I mean, the story was just immaculate. Like, as an English teacher, I was kind of proud, like, damn, that's a good story. And she got all the girls to co sign the story. And the only thing they left out one little detail that I think saved my job, saved my license, was that they said something about, like, me grabbing or choking one of the girls in the doorway. And the saving grace was that I actually had a camera in my doorway. And so when they went back to pull the footage, it was like, that lady didn't even talk to you? This happened this day? No, I think it happened, like, the last week. Okay, let's go pull last week's footage. This lady didn't even talk to you last week? And that was the only thing that saved me, because, unfortunately, where I was working at the time and what the demographics looked like at the time, those girls would have been believed over me. So I can only imagine what it's like when you throw in sexual misconduct or sexual misconduct allegations in a black man in a demographic like this teacher was in this particular area, you're automatically out of there because, yeah, we know how that goes. I'm going to move on to AJ. I want to talk about how important it is for teachers, educators, professionals in general, to have some type of coverage in the event that they are hit with allegations or they need to fight a case. And I'm not talking about the look. What's that? Prepaid legal. You know what I'm talking about? Can I say their name? Don't sue me. Prepaid legal. But they offer that in our benefits package, like, oh, liability insurance for the district. And I always tell people, remember, these people contracted with the district. They work for them, they buddy buddy with them. So you might want to look and get you something else. So talk to us about professional liability insurance. First of all, you can talk to us about insurance in general, because that's your thing. But the importance of teachers having professional liability insurance, especially in today's climate, with everything going on, our great governor yeah. I'll leave that last part out. Yeah, okay. I believe in not just because I'm in the industry. We all have assets and things that we are proud of, that we want to protect. There's no different than when we're in our professional life. I have professional insurance. Your dentist has professional insurance. Your realtors have insurance. So you have gained a level of expertise, and you want to protect that, right? You want to protect the hard work and education and time that you put in to get to where you are in life. And professional liability insurance for teachers specifically can do that. Like we talked about, you work for a school district or charter school, wherever you work, you believe that entity or that company will protect you in the event something would happen. But like we said, everything is sensationalized. So the student is going to get believed first because that's somebody's baby, right? And then you're going to have to defend yourself at some point in front of whoever that is, that committee is. And so you can sleep I like to tell people you can sleep a little better at night if you know you have another layer of protection, right. You don't walk outside without an umbrella, typically, right? It's cold. You don't walk outside without a coat on sometimes. And that's all it is, literally, for pennies on the dollar. I have a lot of educators that work for school districts that also consult, or they're an adjunct professor during the summer for colleges and things like that. And sometimes they've gotten it just because the college requires them to have their own insurance for however, they are not. The yard people messing up the podcast, sorry, all the lawn guys are here. For them to secure contracts and things like that. We've had to get them extra coverage. The good thing about that is now you can go out and solicit other business and other opportunities and, you know, you're always protected under those same limits. Legal calls, anybody that's ever had to use an attorney, they're not cheap, right? It's by the hour, by the minute, but you have costs built in that can take care of that until we can get our teachers some more money. They can pay for lawyers if they but I'll sprinkle it in there. I'm passionate about it. I'm passionate about it, but no. Professional liability insurance is something that anybody that holds a license in whatever your expertise is, I believe it's something you should have because it's only going to protect you in the event something goes wrong. I tell my staff all the time, none of this stuff matters until something. Happens or you don't need it. Need it like car insurance. Don't find out at the wrong time, right? So I'm going to tell you what my understanding of professional liability insurance is and then correct me. I was using my Google, so I know sometimes Google be lying. It's all right that's out there, so it help me understand. So my understanding and I pay for a policy. I don't even know what I'm paying for. I just know that I got to. Get it coming out to check. You do. But anyway, so it covers injuries to students when they're under your supervision. If you are negligent in supervising. So if we're on a playground and little Sally falls down because I'm on my phone on TikTok and little Sally falls from the monkey bars and breaks her neck, that's on me because I was negligent in supervising her. So it would cover. And when I say cover, I don't mean I get off the hook. It just means cover if the parent comes after me personally for not supervising their child properly right. Or too many kids on the seesaw on the slide, they playing dodgeball the wrong way. Things that are in my control correct. You want to make sure and that liability protection is for that. Okay. Violation of civil rights. OCR, complaints. So we have I know the one scary part about a lot of people being certified as special education teachers or when they go into special education is hearing, if you don't follow this kid's, IEP. If you don't follow their 504 plan, the parent can come after you personally for not doing it. Because in the meetings you sign to say, this is a federal document. I am going to comply. I'm going to do whatever I need to do. And sometimes because teachers are human and sometimes because they're asses, they don't follow that paperwork, they don't feel like they should have to, or I forgot this day. And then you have parents that are very savvy when it comes to their children's educational rights, and so they know they can come after you if you don't produce that paperwork or that documentation. I like your shirt, by the way, but did you document I got to take a picture of that. But if you don't document that you've been following everything in that child's plan, the parent can come after you and sue you personally. So I'm understanding that there are some policies that cover that if you need representation or coverage, if that parent sues you and wins. Yeah, I try to tell people all the time, when you get insurance, do what you say you're going to do and do what you're supposed to be doing. Right. Because that's going to protect everybody involved. Like we tell our kids all the time, don't lie to me, because I'm not going to be able to protect you even if you're wrong. Right. If I don't have the truth, it's going to be hard for me to defend you, right? Yeah. If you tell me you're doing XYZ and I'm only consulting and I'm only showing kids how to draw square, but we outside and you showing them how to build a slide and somebody get hurt. That's not what you told me you were going to do. So it's going to be hard for that policy to protect you under the scope of what you were doing. Right. So do what you say you're going to do. Follow the rules, and let's try to be accountable for our actions. Right, but your policy can try to help you if you slip up. All right, so now we got this new thing going on in Florida where we're giving parents, and now it's coming to Texas because of that 88th legislation anyway, where parents are getting more and. More control over curriculum. So now we have possible coverage for improper methods of instruction. So we had a teacher that was in Florida, I want to say like a month or two ago, and she showed some Disney movie. It was innocent Disney movie at the end of the school year. And I think it may have been a parents or a gay couple. I'm probably all wrong about this. Something along the lines of that. And the Moms for Liberty came after her and Job trying to sue her. So now covering teachers needing coverage for something as simple as that, because now we got these laws in place where you can't say this, you can't do this, you can't teach about this, you can't read this. You got these books in your library, and the parent finds out this book is in your school classroom library, the parent can come after you personally. And then this whole new thing with this failure to promote or grant a kid credit. So who would think that you would need personal, professional liability insurance because a kid failed? They didn't do what they were supposed to do, and you denied them credit. You touched on a couple of things. I just got I can't let Pat I told myself I was not coming. Get fired up about this. All right. Those three initials that you said, I find it real hard to believe that anyone that has brought that up in Florida, in Texas, can pinpoint I can speak specifically for Texas. Show me where it's been taught and that your child was discriminated against. It's not harmed in any way. Number one, you don't even know what it means. If we're going to get to the fundamental root of CRT, you don't know what it means. Right? So I have not personally seen any districts that I'm affiliated with, my friends are affiliated with where it's been an issue. Now we get to these library books. I've been in printing school libraries my mom been in printing school libraries. My wife been in I find it real hard to believe that you are being able to go find a particular book that is offensive without you being in there every day or looking for something in particular. Furthermore, don't read it. Don't read it or use it as an educational tool. Right. You do not have to check that book out. It is not a requirement. No. If it's something in there that you don't like to read, there's plenty of books in Barnes and Nobles that I don't like. I don't buy them, period. The same thing applies to our kids. So don't make it an issue if it's not right. But let's go back to what we were talking about on topic. I'll get back on topic. You can have some protection for that. If somebody feels like they're slighted, that an agenda is being pushed on their child, it's more difficult to fail a child than it is to actually push them through, which I don't agree with anyway. But you got to document more if you leave a kid behind right, than just trying to push them along the way. And hopefully they get it, which is. Why a lot of teachers do it just going on legit. Come on. Hopefully you don't get it. I ain't doing this paperwork. So that's the next person deal. Exactly. It makes your job hard if we hold him back. So continue my Googles and again, correct me if I'm wrong because we want to get the people correct information, accurate information. So let's say I am accused of misconduct, okay, and I'm charged with the crime. I go to trial for this crime. I am exonerated or acquitted of this crime. A policy could cover me up to 100% if I'm found not guilty of a criminal or assault of a child. Is that accurate or does it depend on the layer of policy, which type of policy you have? Your insurance policy typically covers you. You could probably quote me on this. And I'm speaking of home insurance, liability insurance, umbrella insurance, professional liability. Your policy covers you until you're in the act of committing a crime, okay. If you are in the act of committing a crime or fraud or anything like that, the policy is null and void. Okay? Right. Like, you have to be a law abiding citizen for this coverage to take place, okay? So if it's something that you are found criminally guilty for, you're going to have a hard time for that policy to protect you depending on the severity of that claim. Right. But if it's something that's subjective that my child wasn't learning or I felt like you harmed my child mentally, intellectually. Whatever that is, the civil type suits no injury involved. Yeah. That's going to be hard for both sides to find fault. Right. But you have a layer of protection in there for you for that. Okay, so now let's talk about the cost. I know you said pennies on the dollar, a couple of $100, whatever you said earlier, but I'm going to go back to this teacher when I talk to this teacher personally myself, and the amount first of all, I know who they hired as their attorney, celebrity criminal defense attorney. And CIS ain't cheap. She's not cheap, right? So I asked, I said, I kind of joked. I said, oh, you got some money. I kind of joked and they said, no. When your freedom is on the line, you don't just go get Tyrone or Sally Joe from down the street to protect you. You got to pull out all the stops because, yes, my name is on the line. Yes, my career is on the line, but my freedom was on the line, so I'm not going to play with the homeboy janky lawyer down the street. So when it comes to these policies, how much level of protection can I get? Like, what if I want to go higher? I'm just shooting our names. I don't even know famous celebrity attorneys to represent me because I know that I have a 99% chance of getting off. How much of that attorney's fees are these policies going to cover? So that's a great question. Your individual carriers are going to have their own in house legal team to protect you. So when you sign up to get this insurance contract, you are saying that whatever company we choose or you choose to go with, you are believing that they have enough legal capacity to protect you in the event of one of these claims arise. If you choose to get outside representation, they may be able to work with that company, but more than likely, you're going to be responsible for that outside representation. Got it. If it exceeds the boundaries of what your policy covers, okay. So you're entitled to that by all means, but your policy is already going to come with legal representation in it if you ever need it. Okay. So when you get to teachers and we always talk about how much money we don't make and how we can't spare an extra expense as far as additional policies. And so you'll have a lot of teachers because the school districts are offered, like, the prepaid legal insurance, and they'll tell you owe $12 a paycheck. And so to a teacher, that's like, oh, bet that's reasonable. I can do that, when in all actuality because they haven't done their homework. It sounds good on the surface, that $12 a check ain't covering nothing, and you still going to be on your own because the district is going to protect them. The district attorneys represent them, not you. You may want to go find something. So how do we navigate the conversation about cost when it comes to teachers, how much they don't make and how they possibly cannot afford to be without a policy like this? Yeah. And I'll take a moment here to say thank you and to all the other educators. I got into this space because of what I saw my parents do. My dad is still a professor at Prayer View. My mom was a counselor at Houston Community College, finished as assistant dean. My dad is still teaching. I saw the impact that they made on young people's lives through education, and that's kind of what I didn't have the full passion to go teach. I do what I do, and my professional career took me a different route. But I appreciate what you all do. Seriously. I know it's thankless. But the impact that you all have on young people is not unnoticed. So when you talk about cost, you do have to do the research, right? And I'll give you this analogy and kind of tie it back to life insurance as well. Your company has job benefits for you, and I tell everybody to go take advantage of it. Right. But like you said, it's for that company, right. It's for them to be able to add another box to check that they're giving you a benefit. Right. So if you need legal representation, I might not want to get thrown into a pot of 15,000 people who also may need this representation. And that $12 does sound good. It sounds affordable, but that's $24. If you get paid twice a month, you're looking at what does that $24 afford me? What if I want to go teach outside of this district part time in the summer, if I want to be an adjunct professor? Does that policy cover me? You can have an outside life insurance policy. You can have your own liability insurance as you build your brand. As an educator, if you decide to step away from an actual ISD or other professional organization right. That's going to cover you no matter what. And so these coverage and I looked up a real one, so you're going to have to have general liability for educators. It's typically three to$500 a year. Okay? Right. For a million dollars of coverage. I'm speaking on a million dollars. We can go up a lot. Okay. We can go up let me write. This down, and then your professional liability will kick in on top of that, which is probably another four or $500 a year. So you're talking about maybe one$200 for basic liability coverage for educators doing what you say you're going to do. Right. $100 a month, $50 a check. That's happy hour money. Correct. Spend that on a couple of shots of hennessy. Right. $10 shots of hennessy. It's easy to go by, but you can protect yourself in the event something happens. Okay. All right, that's good to know. So we can contact you for some professional liability insurance. I sent you some links. They can go. You did? And I must say that you all know I'm doing things outside of education, and he gets my automatic withdrawal every month. Well, I got to make sure you protect it. Yeah, because I'll be on here being reckless. So, yeah, AJ insures me. AJ got me covered. So thank you for that. So let's move on to DeFrances. You're looking at me on the time we good. He'd be rushing me because I know we did some two hour episodes, and he said, I'm not going to hold his Friday up like that. So let's go back to accountability. So with this particular teacher, and this may be something that's a touchy topic to discuss, so don't feel obligated to state your opinion on this. These allegations came out, the investigation was concluded, and now this teacher is exonerated. Now he's supposed to be expected to pick up and go on with his life. What happens to the kids? So should students, you guys feel like students should face students and their families? Because let me go back to this situation. This student's family was on the noodles with all the people, rah, rhine, yahya. We want this, we want that. They were getting all the media attention. So now that it's done, you hear nothing, no apologies, no, we made a mistake, or our child made a mistake. We're working through our child for something that she did. Whatever. So do you guys feel like students and their families who make false allegations against educators should be held liable? Accountable? Accountable and liable financially? What do you think? Absolutely. Do you think so? Absolutely. I think that in the world that we live in now, everyone's, this is happening. And I think I've often said I think that teachers should receive hazard pay because of all of the things that we know that happen in the school. And as I'm sitting here just really soaking in the information that you're providing about the insurance, I would encourage every teacher that's listening professionals to protect yourself. Protect yourself. Because in these situations where I've mitigated risk and led on making sure that everyone was notified, the first priority with the school is to protect the school. And we must remember that. And in the end, as this gentleman, he endured this really and truly. This will rock the rest of his career. It doesn't matter if he was exonerated or what people think. And let's just also factor in that he's a black male. And so as he's trying to move forward, looking at that promotion, someone's going to always remember when they Google, you never know what story they're going to pull up. That's a whole nother topic. And I said I wasn't even going to talk about this because I didn't want it to get too specific. But when I spoke to him, if you put the situation, the school, whatever in Google, the first three pages, ten hits on each page is going to be that. It's going to be that all the positive things that he's done for the community that he works in or the past, previous communities that he's worked in, because he's been an educator for quite some time. All that stuff is on, like, page four, page five, but what's on page one, two, three still is that story. No press release from the district saying, our bad, we made a mistake, or after I can't say a mistake because they had to do their jobs as well, I guess. But after we've conducted our investigation, oh, oops, my bad, none of that is there. And so I questioned a couple of it people like, how do you even call Google and get this mess up off of here? And I'm like, oh, yeah, you could pay. I think it's called a scrum Master. I can't remember what it's called. Some of your representation and coverage that you afford yourself can make some of that go away. Oh, that's interesting to know because they told me, like, almost $700 per hit. Depends on what it is. But you can make it go away. But it's going to cost you. Yeah. Even after you're exonerated, it's going to cost somebody. And I've seen some of it go as part of the settlement. Right. Like we agree. I think consequences should be for students who lodge false allegations against the teacher. The false ones, the ones with these fairytale stories like mine. My girls had them a Nobel Peace Prize or a good Grammy writing story. I don't know. Emmy what you call it when it's the TV. Yeah, they had a good story going on. Well, let me just say this. Let's keep it real. HR. Okay. So what happens? Nothing, unfortunately. We know that when we look at the whole situation, schools are also businesses. Hello. Especially charters. People forget that. So schools are businesses. And so they need everybody there. Everybody there. That's how they get paid. And so with that being said, you will see in almost in any situation, they will never expel the student. They may suspend them. But I think that as I've looked at some cases, what's happened is that teachers are now saying, we're going to sue you for slander. And so I think that they're now taking it a step further to protect themselves, but to make sure that I think that they set an example for these parents that are supporting their students with this bad behavior, without divulging information, of course. But I've seen these situations happen, and unfortunately, that teacher may have to relocate that much damage is done to them in terms of their career. Going to do everything to make sure that our students are safe. The integrity and safety of our students are our first person. Everybody got the same damn temple. Exactly. They must pass that out at the superintendent conferences in the summer everywhere. They all have the same song. And so I think that this is a very timely conversation, and especially with, uh, with the wealth of information that you're providing. Hell, I think I'm going to purchase some insurance. Let me give you another tidbit on how insurance works as it relates to minors. Okay? And parents specifically. You can replace school, incident, with movie theater playground. As a parent, we are liable for anybody that lives in our household. Right. Until they're not. Our homeowners insurance policy has liability on it. I may or may not have an umbrella policy. If my child does something while he or she is under my roof, if somebody decides to pursue it, it's my fault, right? Until something else happens, it's my fault. If I go hit a golf ball through somebody's window on the golf course, my liability insurance can pay for that. So you take that on up to whatever scenario or arena you're in that is very with a minor. They live somewhere. And I'm not trying to say we're going to punish the kids, but we go back to this accountability piece. And that is one thing we got to get back to as a society. Yes, Lord. You need to be held accountable for what you you just can't be out here reckless with your words and your actions. Now, you're not going to like some of it sometime. You ain't like the vegetables all the time, but you ate them. Yeah, right. So we've got to show these kids accountability matters. But also, as they used to say back at the rears, we can put them folks in your life, put them. People in your life, and that'll make you act right. Now you got me intrigued. This policy, right? So my liability, my household insurance, let's say my daughter, and she better not ever, because I'd kill a dead my daughter goes through and cooks up a liar, says she's going to cook some fairytale story about a teacher because she got a zero on an assignment that she didn't do. So she and her friends get together and cook up this story about the PE coach and everything comes out. She's a liar. She lied. Let's call it what it is. And now he's coming after me because she belongs in my household. She lies. She's my child. I have insurance, homeowners insurance policy. She caution it. They're just as equally responsible, especially in a situation where and we know kids are kids, and kids often tell lies. And so in that situation, we definitely, as parents looking through a parental lens, I hold my kids accountable if they're doing something wrong, right. And I always take it back into the HR space. We're all human. And I've heard sometimes where people have felt that, oh, gosh, we can't trust HR because we HR is not your friend. HR is not your friend. We hear that all the time. Well, let me just say this. I am a workplace advocate, and I think that that was why I recognize that my career is taking me on a different path. Because if an organization is not operating out of integrity, I can't ride with you because of my integrity, my expectations, and my standards. And I think that when employees are in a situation and if they're seeing this in their organization, in their school, you better have insurance and you better leave. You better get out. Okay. So that brings me to my next question. I actually have two more. I know he's giving me the evil eye on this time, but my next question, when you go back, when you're found not guilty, when you're exonerated, when your name is kind of cleared and you go back, is it best for the teacher to go back to that same environment? Because this particular teacher was like, you know what? The school district didn't really do anything to me to be technical. They did what they were supposed to do, which is their job, which is investigate. But do I even want to come back there. My reputation is forever tarnished. All the grade I did is forever done. Is it safe for that teacher to report back to that same place that caused them so much trauma? Probably not. I would always recommend reassignment, if that's possible, to another school. But we have to factor in the psychological harm that's taking place for that teacher. I would definitely recommend for that teacher to be reassigned to another school if that will make that teacher feel safe continuing to do the work that they do. Because at that point now we've handcuffed the teacher not only just for them to function in their essential job duties, but also their creativity. All of the things that we want our children to experience, they no longer have that in that instructor, that teacher. And so I would definitely recommend reassignment for that teacher. So last thing before we get up out of here, what kind of support systems are in place? How often does the teacher come back and sue the district and say, you know what? Y'all were a part of this. What kind of settlement can teachers get from districts? Or are districts going to be able to get away with? We were doing our job. Usually most employees are afraid. They are afraid of that process. We know that the EEOC is backed up in complaints if they feel in some manner that they've been discriminated against, if, say, the discipline that they receive was severe. So punitive, unnecessarily. I think that they definitely should hire an attorney. But truly, there aren't a lot of support systems in place internally to provide that teacher with support. That's crazy. It really is. It's unfortunate. And I think that that's why we have to die. It's time consuming as I'm wearing this shirt. Document. Document. So in the event that that situation happens, you have to document create a chronological document stating every single detail of what transpired, so that when you hand this over to an attorney, they have all the information to conduct their own investigation, but also to provide you with the support that you'll need to move forward in your career. So in the event, like this particular teacher said, completely blindsided, completely, like, going to work like it's a normal day, and then boom, hey, we got these allegations against you. And then come to find out this particular teacher didn't even know the kid. I don't even teach you. I don't even know you at all. But you were still able to cook up this story. And I think in this particular situation, before the district even ran a full in house investigation, right? Because did you do due diligence? Because you would have been like, wait, this happened to you 20 times and 20 kids, and this is really weird. Oh, wait, this person's not even on your schedule. This person's not even in your grade level. You're in a whole different wing where you're taking your classes from where this person is stationed. So how did this even occur? So for it to go all the way that it's went without the district doing proper due diligence and then their apology not being as loud as their allegations were, as loud as their disrespect was, I feel like teachers should have something should happen with the district teacher. They should need to make amends. I just feel like that I don't know. It's weird. No, I think I agree. But it's sad to say that it's unfortunately not that way, because their business, they don't protect it's their business. And I think that in that situation, I'm so sorry that that happened to him and his family, but the reality is that schools first will protect themselves, and that's just something that we have to understand and recognize. I thought about something, okay. As we talked about this topic, our kids play sports or they dance or they cheer, whatever, and they practice all the time, right? Scenarios. Or if this happens, be prepared to do this. Would it be beneficial for a school system to have a class or not even necessarily a class, a workshop on if this happens, this is what we would do for you. It would definitely be beneficial, but I don't see a lot of school systems wasting their resources on training your training, because we can't even get training for special education, for the things that we need to get training for. In a perfect world, I think it would be great. But that means a district would have to own the fact that this could possibly happen. Correct. Remember, they have to paint themselves as these utopian places, and so that doesn't happen here in Utopia. Now, even if when it does happen, we have a lot of school district school systems that they'll hurt and brush that shit under the rug. Do it in every other aspect. Right? Like, our HR teams have to practice the upcoming the best practices. Right? Let's talk about that, because that's some BS. Wait, hold on. We got to talk about that in. The next okay, but let me just say this. When we talk about training and development training and development, it's usually a course. How many of us have taken oh. The training itself. While I'm vacuuming, while. They'Re doing certain trainings, like sexual harassment, any type of misconduct that could possibly impact your career, these trainings need to be conducted live. These are not trainings that you should have. Allow employees to just click on their computer and just check the dots are. While I'm working out. Exactly. And that's what's happening. That they're not receiving real training. So I think that, again, we have to take ownership and get that insurance, do all the things to make sure that we protect ourselves in the event that this does occur. Absolutely. Doesn't matter. Till some happens. Till some happens. All right. Ty, you got a workshop or webinar or something like that. Coming up, I know that people don't want to hear more before we bring you back. So tell me about what you have going on July the fifth is that I can't remember what the email said. Yes, it is on July the fifth and this webinar, we will have conversation on addressing workplace discrimination. What we do know is that it's been on the rise, I think, post Trump. And so we're seeing more cases. And as I've shared in a previous podcast, is that the EEOC is backed up with claims. And so probably about 1% of the claims that they receive, they're not moving forward with investigations, so they're just issuing right to sue letters. Okay. And so with that in this presentation, I really want to equip all of our participants that are asking questions about what do I do in this situation? So we'll have conversations about laws, antidiscrimination laws, how to protect yourself, how to recognize those red flags. Okay. And really the takeaway is that if this situation is happening to you, I would like to provide you with the tools and the resources on how to move forward in making sure that you protect yourself. Okay. So this is a free webinar that you're going to be giving out. Free. Okay. And so how can we can you send me the link so I can post it on my social media so I can give people the access to it in eventbrite. All right, cool. So we'll take care of that. Put those information on my site so you guys can get them because we like the free. Yes. All right. Thank you, Ms. Ty. You're welcome. All right, well, again, thank you to our sponsor, AJ Insures Me. So wrap it up. Teachers get you all some professional liability insurance. You got to get you some call my guy and get you some insurance because especially my Texas teachers, my Florida teachers, I don't know what our leaders got cooking, but it's some foolishness about to come down the pipeline. And you all better be careful, especially with some of these moms groups and these other conservative education groups coming after you all and knowing the ins and outs to come after you all. You all better protect yourselves. So again, thank you, AJ and sures me. Thank you, Ty. I appreciate you all coming on. Tom had to keep you back for a little bit because I think we need to do a whole nother episode. You start talking about yeah, you talk about this and I think we need some more tea on that. So probably going to have you stick around and come back for another episode, if you don't mind. I will be here. All right. All right. Thank you guys again for tuning in to another episode of Regional Force Finest, the podcast. We'll see you guys back next week. Balm just this podcast was made possible by producer extraordinaire D Francis at the. Legendary Lab Seven Studios in Mo City, Texas.